I haven’t spend time so far with DIrac and i don’t know what really changes will do.
I owned the SA 30 for 1 week now and i enjoy the default situation before i will start to play with Dirac.
But to tell you my truth i don’t rely on Dirac , i will try it and i hope to get extra nice sound but i don’t think it will replace my willing for a better set of speaker at the future (currently MA RS6).
And my opinion about music, you must not put it inside boxes, it is art and art is not constraint.
Measurement is for observation on technical level to read and understand what to change/improve to get the most pleasing sound according to the DNA of the creator.
Also we must not forget the physical materials that gave to an instrument a total different approach to the sound.
If we want to add music into measurement boxes then all the speakers will be exactly the same with just different firmware
*We need both worlds for better products “religion” & Science
I own the B&W 706S2 with the Marantz PM7000N the bass was terrible.
With Arcam sa30 are the B&W a big surprise and a total change. They sound great.
But before you buy you have to listen to them!
What i would recomend you to try are.
Q Acoustics Concept 500’s
Ken Ishiwata picked the (4000€)Concept 500, compared to the (11000€) B&W 802d3.
After reading most posts here I decided to add something after all
I believe that speakers have a sound signature, but I’m very much on board with the idea that with any eq or dirac or other correction tools you can make most speakers sound as you want them to. I own the Harbeth P3ESRs and I love em, and as someone stated above, I can tune them to my will. They don’t go super low, but if I use a -10db harmann target curve, the bass becomes too pronounced already.
In my opinion, if you don’t own a bad pair of speakers, the eq will take care of most of the rest and you can tune most speakers the way you want them to sound. By the way, that’s why I don’t understand how most people don’t use EQ but buy a different set of speakers. Just play around with the EQ/Dirac first.
I start experiments with Dirac and 1st notice is that it takes the Voice and most of the music to the Centre.
Yes the Bass become more tight but i feel that i am loosing a big % of soundstage.
Immediately when i select Dirac Filter the Whole music close inside the 2 speakers, it sounds that it comes from the Centre .
Of course after a while you forget it but when you disable the filter everything is open again.
I have this feeling even when i measure the Whole sofa with the 17 points of measurement.
Also same feeling with partial correction at low frequencies 60hz to 400hz.
imho, even with dirac disabled the sound should come from the centre. If the vocals do not seem to be right in front of you then I think your speakers aren’t positioned correctly. The speakers and the main listening position should be placed in a equilateral triangle, refer to diagram b in the link below. Hope this helps.
This was I felt my experience to, it gave the sound more mid range punch and as you say pushed the vocals forward but at the expense of everything else. However, after this I then realised I had applied it without first calibrating the mic, so have you done that? Have a look on the Arcam product page for mic calibration and target files download.
As I am happy with the non-Dirac sound I never bothered going back to correct my mistake
That’s because recordings you listen to are done this way.
Dirac is actually making it sound more like creator intended, it’s “focusing” everything. What you hear without it is Soundstage expanded in uncontrolled way by unwanted reflections etc. With Dirac Soundstage is not so wide, but everything is in it’s place. Also in my experience Soundstage becomes deeper, more 3 dimensional than wide.
At first I had similar feelings about this, but actually now it sounds better and more natural for me. When I disable DL Soundstage becomes wider, but at the same time “messy”, voices are unnaturally big/wide, as well as other instruments.
As for correcting below 400Hz, I might be wrong here (someone correct me if so), but as far as I understand how DL works, when moving a curtain down to 400Hz, it actually disables only frequency correction. Everything else what DL correct (phase, reflections) is still corrected in full spectrum. Hence Soundstage is also corrected.
Was trying 17 point measurements, and turned out I actually prefer 9 and 13 points. Currently using 9 points. Depending on your room, 17 points might actually try to correct to much, as it averages measured response. So if you have a bump in the bass on far left corner of your sofa, it will correct that, lowering the bass output in other places, including sweet spot. So it’s a tradeoff.
In my case it actually did exactly that + it also reduced highs, as there is a bump in this area on the other end of the sofa (very bad speaker and listening position placement, but unfortunately only possible/optimal due to other living room functions, like… living ). So much better option for me it’s 9 points, as I’m usually listening from the sweet spot. Actually planning to experiment one day with even less points, down to even 1 (for a test). Let’s see how it works. With 17 points sound was too… dull for my taste. But that’s partly/mostly cause of the room.
Going to buy new speakers for my SA30. Have listen to B&W speakers at my dealer. Is there anyone using the 606, 607 or 603 (maybe the new anniversary version too)? Opinion about them…?
I’m pleased with my Kef R7’s with the SA30. Very easy to listen to for extended listening sessions which was one of my requirements. I don’t think you want to go for a speaker much warmer than an R7 though. I think the SA30 is a very rich sweet sounding amp which wouldn’t suit a very warm speaker.
I listened to the Sonus Faber Sonetto III and Sonetto V speakers at my dealer. Impressive sound. I am considering the Sonetto III to replace my (very old) Driade D90’s.
Taking into the account the usual parameters of room size and budget, I bought a pair of ATC SCM11s to go with the SA30. It was a part exchange on a 25 year-old system comprising a Krell pre and power amp and a pair of Kef reference floorstanders. I was moving flat and wanted something a little more nimble and lifestyle oriented without significant loss in musical engagement and thrill. Something with a reasonably large but not overwhelming sound stage, a very high degree of transparency and neutrality…allowing the music to speak for itself.
I can safely say about 50 hours in, my listening smile continues to grow as I explore streamed versions of my music collection and beyond. Of course, the shift in power and switch to monitors has resulted in a reduction in sheer scale and projection, but the emotional engagement and dynamic excitement more than compensate.
I was fortunate enough to be able to audition them before committing, but was very pleasantly surprised to discover they sound even better in my new apartment.
I have 2 “high-end” systems and 1 prosumer at home. The prosumer is got all the bells and whistles for automatic room correction and the other 2 don’t. So for the “high-end” ones, I spent quite a lot of time with REW and calibrated microphone, to configure in the computer an inverse filter to compensate for room acoustics.
This is what I learned (your mileage may vary)
Perfect flat curve response measured in your room is extremely boring and unengaging
Each speaker + amp have their own sonic signature, and no matter how much you correct, it would still be there
Audio manufacturers know much more about their products than me, and I was never able to transform a combination (speaker +amp) I did not like into something I really enjoyed, so there your expectations on how much you can influence for good with source corrections should be limited
Speaker selection and room placement is what really makes a difference, and for that, tools like Rew and your ears are key. I have been able to correct low frequency standing waves only through speaker placement, no matter how much I spent on noise traps and Helmholtz chambers.
So, to answer your question:
Chose your speakers matching your room size. Small speakers + good sub(s) are more flexible for placement than larger equivalent floor standers.
Datasheet response curve is important, it has to be “right” but what really matters is if you enjoy what comes out from the speakers, and that has a lot to do with what you have heard during your entire life in terms of music.
If you enjoyed Monitor Audio and their sonic signature I would stick to the brand, but get a newer higher-end model. I currently own MA platinum II + REL sub in one of my systems and loving it. It is a small room. In this same room, I had a couple of top-of-the-line JBL huge floor standers and was never able to make them sound right, although they were fantastic in bigger rooms.
I also played a lot with KEF ls50 meta + subs on this same room, and they were ok, but the Monitor Audio were significantly better (diminishing returns apply) on imaging and highs
One of my speaker-sets is MA RX8, and they combine really well with the SA30. RX8’s need control and the right speaker cable can help also in that respect.
Did sometime ago buy a pair of Bowers & Wilkins 603 S2 Anniversary speakers. Had Mirage M-390is before that. What a difference! Now the SA30 ”came alive”! Next step is to make a Dirac curve for them and see what it will do. So far, I think this was a very good combination…
